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Re: [patterns-discussion] Cultural Dependencies and the YOU form.


Chronological Thread 
  • From: Linda Rising <risingl AT tds.net>
  • To: Joseph Bergin <jbergin AT pace.edu>
  • Cc: patterns-discussion AT cs.uiuc.edu
  • Subject: Re: [patterns-discussion] Cultural Dependencies and the YOU form.
  • Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2013 13:44:20 -0600
  • List-archive: <http://lists.cs.uiuc.edu/pipermail/patterns-discussion/>
  • List-id: General talk about software patterns <patterns-discussion.cs.uiuc.edu>

When Mary Lynn and I were working on the patterns for Fearless Change, we encountered cultural differences in many of our solutions. The most
startling one was "Do Food." We were informed by participants in one workshop that in their organization in Japan, you would never have food *AND*
discuss work-related topics during the day. Our Japanese friends said the Do Food pattern was better implemented after work in a pub. After that we heard from
others in companies around the world that the Pub pattern was preferred :-)!



On 2/19/2013 8:12 AM, Joseph Bergin wrote:
I've been suggesting to my students for years that they write patterns in the
YOU form, as if addressed to the person who must carry out the solution. I've
also suggested that the solution be stated strongly in an imperative form.
Here is a tiny excerpt, derived from the pedagogical pattern Round Robin.
I'll leave out much of it, just to get the flavor:

Round Robin
Context: You are teaching a course in which students are expected to learn
through their discussions...
Problem: You want all students to participate in a discussion.
Solution: Therefore, use a round robin technique to solicit suggestions.

I've always thought of this as a good form. However, I'm teaching the course again
and, as usual, learning a few things from my students. I have students from all
over the world. Some students from India and Pakistan questioned the use of the
YOU form for patterns. They say that it seems impolite to them, since the
solutions are imperative. There are language issues of course, with Urdu and Tamil
having separate you forms for use with different people. I think these words have
different import than the European versions (Usted, vs. tu). The European versions
seem mostly to represent "degree of association - strangers vs. family), or
the German impersonal forms (man), but it may be different (say, hierarchical)
elsewhere.

As a result of the discussion, I've been playing with an I form (first person
singular rather than second person). For example:

Context: I'm teaching a course in which students are expected to learn
through their discussions...
Problem: I want all students to participate in a discussion.
Solution: Therefore, I use a round robin technique to solicit suggestions.

The rest of the pattern would need to be changed to match, of course.

What do you think about all this? Have you heard this in your travels or
pattern writing/usage? The I form doesn't sound as strong to me, but
interesting. What advice would you give to pattern writers in this area?

Linda Rising suggested I post this here, and Jutta gave good advice that she
may want to repeat here.

Thanks for your thoughts.
Joe

PS. I'll be wanting three good shepherds pretty soon, also. Let me know,
privately, if you are interested.
---
Joseph Bergin, Professor Emeritus in Residence
Pace University, Computer Science, One Pace Plaza, NY NY 10038
EMAIL
jbergin AT pace.edu
HOMEPAGE http://csis.pace.edu/~bergin/
---
you shall above all things be glad and young.
For if you’re young, whatever life you wear

it will become you;and if you are glad
whatever’s living will yourself become

- - e. e. cummings










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--
Co-Author of Fearless Change: patterns for introducing new ideas
http://www.fearlesschangepatterns.com

Check out my new web site
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